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Snorting Sublingual Ativan?

Discussion in 'Therapy / Medications' started by FUBAR, May 24, 2012.

  1. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member Can Ban

    Before this thread gets off on another tangent, we have finally hit a 'FACT'. There is nothing out there that gets rid of 'Nightmares'. All medication does is alter your conscious state, that is why you still feel tired in the mornings, you are not going into a full REM cycle. It's just like alcohol, all you end up in is a stupor.
    When it gets down to it, not having a REM cycle is one of the factors which caused our PTSD. We were exposed to a traumatic experience and did not REM sleep (over there) and therefore did not get to file away the trauma as a memory.

    Proper therapy helps to file the trauma away so it acts as a memory instead of floating around between our ears causing intrusive thoughts and nightmares.
    Ned likes this.
  2. JarHed

    JarHed Well-Known Member Can Ban

    Exactly Jimmy

    Taking too many drugs makes you dependent on them. And as you said, they can be the cause of your problems as well. And an additional word of advice, ditch the pot. It can actually cause anxiety if you have any and it sounds like you do.

    You have to root out the causes for your anxiety, sleep disorders and depression. They are all linked. Drugs just cover it over for a while. It's OK at first to help get you by but therapy is the only way to sort out the problems and get off some of the drugs. It's hard but worth it in the long run.

    Jar
    Ned likes this.
  3. Sludge

    Sludge Well-Known Member

    DO NOT snort anything, man. Seriously, you think you have problems now? Don't rot out your upper respiratory system!

    The whole "it will work faster" bit is bullshit. Lorazepam is not water soluble. Period. The fillers and binders will cause all sorts of horrible inflammation issues and the drug itself will literally burn off your respiratory ccilia and permanently damage the aveoli in your lungs.

    Stick with he sublingual method it is designed for unless you have salivary glands in your sinuses! If that ain't working, do the right thing and consult your doctor.
    tho9900, Ned, Wagon and 1 other person like this.
  4. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member Can Ban

    Jar,

    As much as I am an avid campaigner against Pot, for some people it is the only thing they have that might work at the moment. But it should only be an interim thing until they find the right combination of medication.
    I thought medical marijuana was the ducks nuts until I found what the additional chemicals were doing to my body.
    It now takes three times as much pain medication to have any effect with me due to 'POT' building up the pain receptors in my brain.

    The other thing which only occurs in a very tiny percentage, and usually only in older patients is liver failure, or the liver failing after years of trying to break down medications. If they could legalise medical marijuana and extract the pain reducing THC from it, they would make millions.

    The only other way to use marijuana is via cooking, making a hash butter, or by inhaling using a vaporiser. That way you are heating not burning and therefore not releasing some of the harmful chemicals.

    There has been a great improvement in the cloning and cross pollination of hybrid varieties of marijuana. They have crossed it with a wide variety of herbs and have made great inroads, but at present, it is still not legal.
    Here is Aus, they do give it to terminal patients and it eases their pain.
  5. JarHed

    JarHed Well-Known Member Can Ban

    Hey Jimmy

    I know pot has it's uses as you've mentioned. It's just that self medicating whether it's alcohol or pot is OK for a bit at first but not in the long term. All meds have a good and bad side as well.

    One of the immunosuppressants that I was on had so many side effects that the info came in a book. Not a good sign. It did help my condition but I'm always concerned about the 'after effects'. It's that way with everything. you take one thing to help you with one condition and hope that it doesn't cause another. I sometimes wonder about the mess we've gotten ourselves into. As they say you pay your nickle and you take your chance.

    Jar
  6. Sludge

    Sludge Well-Known Member

    The issue with pot is that there is absolutely no valid research that naturally occurring cannaboids have any benefit in PTSD treatment. There are synthetic cannaboids that show promise, however they are chemically different in structure and work on different parts of the neural chemistry.

    I'm not certain how much you all are into reading hard science shit, but my biochemistry training forces me to give you this link for more information on PTSD treatments, cannboids, and that sort of thing. If anyone wants copies of the actual papers, I have access to them and it constitutes "fair use" to make them available to you. PM me direct if you would like a few of them. Working on this master's thesis has some benefits...

    If anything, you will discover like I did that this sort of reading will knock you out cold for hours...

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/09/110921120037.htm

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/search/?keyword=PTSD

    http://www.nature.com/npp/journal/v30/n3/abs/1300655a.html

    And to get back on topic here is some relevant research on that damned Lorazepam (sorry, I am really against giving folks like us addictive, limited usefulness time span drugs....)

    http://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/dailymed/drugInfo.cfm?id=22026

    http://prescription-drug.addictionblog.org/snorting-lorazepam/

    That last one is a blog and therefor as valid as MAD magazine or The Onion, as I do not have the relevant papers on hand. I can get them tomorrow at the Uni if you are interested.
  7. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member Can Ban

    Thanks Sludge, really exciting reading..........zzzzzzzzzzzz

    Nah, I have been an anti benzo person for a little while now, since I found out how addictive they can be, and also how they can have negative effects on people with PTSD. But some people mate don't have any other treatment for their anxiety.
    The most important thing I think prescribers need to tell people is that it's only a short term fix.
  8. FUBAR

    FUBAR Member

    Well, I can say that recently I have had some really good sessions with my therapist and I have been able to address some of the incredibly negative thought processes that were dragging me down, and I've been able to learn how to deal better with depression and panic without immediately becoming suicidal and whatnot. I've been doing much better recently, perception and attitude are everything, right?
    I've been trying to reduce my weed smoking to only when it's absolutely necessary, i.e. not smoking it recreationally or daily but only when I have panic that's not resolving through any other means, and I try to make it a last instead of a first resort, which usually means I give my ativan a chance first and if that and trying to calm myself mentally don't work then the weed. It's only very recently that I've begun to come up out of the very dark hole I've been in so I'm going to give myself awhile and see how I do and if certain things improve but in the meantime I've been a bit of an insomniac and sometimes find it impossible to sleep and so have to get so stoned I pretty much pass out, and then once I get up for work I have to take those little extra strength energy shots to stay awake, and I'm sure that's not a good cycle for my body. I have Seroqel but I haven't touched it since I didn't really enjoy the last time I was on sleeping meds and I'm very reluctant to try them again.
  9. Sludge

    Sludge Well-Known Member


    Good to hear manno. A suggestion I make that you should discuss with your Doc is diet. I know, sounds crazy, but I found that mostly eliminating MSG (monosodium glutimate) and corn syrup from my diet, I started sleeping much better. Naturally occurring versions are fine, but if they show up in the first eight ingredients on the label, I try to avoid the product. It sounds tough, but it really isn't. I also found I appreciate a small bag of Doritios, or a Coke, much, much more.

    MSG has some very interesting effects on our circadian cycles (sleep/wake) and neuroprocessing function. The data is a bit hard to find and far too technical to even bother with here, but trust me when I say that it really does help me out by avoiding it in high amounts.

    No matter what the fun propaganda on TV tells you, "corn sugar" is nothing like cane sugar on a biological level. Chemically similar, yes, but corn contains different plant hormones and peptides that we are only just now beginning to understand. Sounds crazy, I know, but without going into a serious biochem lecture, I assure you that the human body DOES NOT process these chemicals the same way as cane sugar. In fact, even cane sugar has downsides. Truth be told the "best" of the sweets are the fruit based pectins.

    Sounds really strange, but these are just some of the changes I had to make to get off the damned pills and still keep the beast well beaten and locked in a dark box.
    tho9900 and T^3 like this.
  10. T^3

    T^3 Active Member

    Thanks, I knew about the "corn sugar",, HFCS but totally forgot about MSG. Man, there goes my ramen night. Most beef/veg/chix bases have MSG but you think the naturally occurring ones are different? Not sure what to look for on the label, any tips?
  11. FUBAR

    FUBAR Member

    Well if you looked at my diet I doubt you'd find a lot of either, but it's good to keep in mind I guess.
  12. Sludge

    Sludge Well-Known Member

    As MSG is literally a component of yeast "excrement" it is impossible to avoid and technically all natural, BUT in really high doses, like what is used to boost the flavors in dehydrated cheeses and the like (I use Doritios as a great example, and most any cheese flavored "box" dinner) some strange things happen. Think of it this way- one serving of Doritios Nacho Cheese Flavor chips has the MSG equivalent of eating 12 kilos of pure cultured yeast!

    When hunting for it on labels, it is not hard to find- just look for "monosodium glutamate". Again, no need to try and eliminate it from the diet, just limit the intake.

    Also keep in mind each of us is different- what works for me may not do a damn thing for you. I know of at least one case study where a PTSDer had to eliminate artificial red food dyes, thus having to give up commercial red meats, just to get a good nights sleep.

    That is the lousy part about dietary chemistry and neuropharmocology- each one of us is a significantly different case on that level.
    1 person likes this.
  13. jamz

    jamz Active Member

    Fubar,

    It sounds dead ringer to my situation my man.
    My attacks are so severe that I cant think speak or at times comprehend in that moment.
    If the bank or VAC rings my cell I dont answer, if they contnue I turn it off or Im going to smash my phone.

    I get into fight or flight mode... not a lot of paralysis like some.
    So if Im in a crowd, Im litterally shoving ppl out of my way or Im on top of someone.

    If you are into smoking ganja for self medicating, and not recreational use be very very careful.
    I do this also and being a pothead have learned much about cannabis use.
    And I am from Canada and we have some primo bud in these here parts.
    First, there are hallucinogenic properties within THC... and if you are smoking some Nothern Lights or BC Hydro and not the usual farm grown hippy huydro nonsense... you can really mess yourself up. And pot is addictive, perhaps not like coke or smack... but what for me used to be a 1 or AT MOST 2 gram habit a day turned into huffing back back 1/2 ounces(14/15 grms) in 2 days.
    You never know what you're getting and its potency.

    Last if you are using marijuana as a medicinal use to relieve the anxiety and panic attacks... talk to your doctor to see if you can get on it. If it is legal where you are at to be on medicinal ganja, but then be very upfront with your dr. Tell them about your condition and how much you smoke and for how long.

    Hope this helps?
  14. FUBAR

    FUBAR Member

    Sorry I'm so late in replying, I haven't been on the site in a few weeks. I've had two times now where I've been hallucinating, my own fault for taking too many bong hits but everyone keeps telling me "Dude, you can't hallucinate on weed," but I do and yeah I have smoked some epically good stuff. My only worry really is that I don't want to constantly develop more tolerance thereby needing more weed... I try to keep my use to a minimum and there are times where I really need a joint but I do try to find other ways to deal with my anxiety, depression, etc without resorting to weed first but the truth is it's the only thing that works most of the time and I really don't know what else to do.

    I've been upfront with my doc about the fact I'm using weed for my panic and he's basically told me that while it works in the short run, it can cause increased anxiety in the long run. That's a really depressing thought because the only reason I'm alive right now is weed and I told him straight out that if I hadn't been stoned out of my mind for most of May I would have killed myself because the panic was so bad. So he's doubled my antianxiety medication dose and I'll see how that works but I'm afraid that it'll end up just like the weed - increased tolerance, and needing to constantly up the dose ad nauseum with my panic always coming back in the end. I'm at the pint right now where I'm not sure if I care that weed causes increased anxiety in the long run because I don't know how else to survive right now and I kind of feel like in the future I might just off myself if weed and meds stop working or cause problems. But I'm going to try to really give me increased med dose and therapy a good chance and see if I can stabilize my anxiety enough to not need weed. I think I'm actually going to start a separate post altogether re weed/my meds.

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